45 Biblically Supported Reasons Organized Religion is Over 

[music] Dear friend, if you want to feel better, don't let the devil make you toss this letter. If you've been crushed up by hoodoo, voodoo, the wizard or the lizard, [music] you got family trouble, man trouble, woman trouble, no life through the rubble. You're looking for a true friend or a true lover or a living undercover? Well, I'm coming to you down to break it all down and help you with all of this. I'm looking to help you find this one day or one way. Can't miss. [music] I'm here to tear all the walls down. Doesn't matter if it's a large town or a small town. [music] Just like Joshua and the famous walls of Jericho. I'm here to tend on the institution, but you must tell seven friends. You must first bring seven friends. And don't be selfish and keep this all to yourself and don't eat selfish. Hate is trying to take someone else's love for yourself. But I'm here to tell you that love is trying to help someone else. [music] You need to see me right away so I can fix this. You need to see me right away. You need to see me right away so I can fix this up. You need to see me right about now. And if you are suffering a street sickness or someone is blocking up all of your success, you need to [music] see me right away so I can fix this. [music] I'M SINCERELY YOURS AND FAITH, LOVE, AND PEACE. YOUR FRIENDSHIP. >> Hey guys, it is Delaney and Sean. We are here with Heart of the Matter and uh so grateful that you have gathered with us. >> Welcome. It's Heart of the Matter Epiphany. This is the eighth episode and um just want to announce that this Sunday, March 8th, we have the introduction meeting to our third annual Yeshuan leadership program. So if you want to uh just get some information on it, you don't have to be committed to it. You're welcome to join us. Um email me delaney yesuins.faith or contact us through the app, the Yeshuan app if you want to join. >> We have a pretty good group already. Yeah, there's a Yeah, there's I think maybe 12 people that are going to >> be doing it this year. >> Our third install. So, we've had and and the people in the previous they they uh create our think tank. >> Yeah. So, that's the whole point of the Yeshuan's app. We have If you hear construction in the background, sorry. >> All hell breaks loose the minute we turn the camera on. Um uh the point of Yeshuan's app is to both host all the content that we've made, but especially encourage people to go through the Yeshuan education system, which teaches biblical fulfillment. Then it goes through the four L's and four traits on spiritual growth outside of organized religion. And then it gets deep into leadership training um which is really a program that helps people uh figure out how to love God and love others on their own out in their own religious settings um and really face the context of their individual lives and how to do that best. And then once you do that, you become part of the Yeshuan think tank which is like our board that we meet with quarterly uh to consult with on the direction of the ministry. >> Yeah. And these are salt of the earth souls who uh they think for themselves. They do their own research and they believe as they are led and we love them to death. >> Yep. >> Also this Sunday, March 8th, we have a afternoon call-in show. Starts at 2 to 3. But this Sunday, uh, we are going to open our call-in show up to you guys to tune in as we host Ratio Christie. This is our sixth or seventh time that we've done this. And, uh, students from all over the place come in under the title of Ratio Christiey's uh, campus outreach to kids and we talk about their apologetic work to the LDS. That's why they're in town. And so their leader, he stops off and he brings them to us. usually first and we eviscerate them with all of our stuff and then they leave hating us, reinforce that their views are correct and then they go and attack the Mormons. [laughter] >> That is demonstrated on social media as the one like slightly viral clip we have is a is from one of those exchanges. People just hate it. >> Yeah. >> They hate it. And by the way, >> or they love it. It's really it. Sorry, I don't mean just hate. It's both. So >> yeah, no, it's good. >> See what you think. >> And uh when I say they attack the Mormons, they are becoming more savvy on how to do it without the attack. >> Yeah, but when you point blank ask them are they going to hell, they all raise their hand. That's the >> I was just going to say that. That is exactly the point that they can be nice and everything else in their approach, but if they believe they're going to hell. >> Yeah. >> When it when we are supposedly mean in person, but believe they're going to heaven. Yeah. >> So, which one is worse? >> The Mormons hate us cuz they say you're you're against us. You're And we say you're okay. >> Yeah. >> Like challenge you to your face. I don't know which one's worse. >> Yeah. To be to be conniving and pretend or to be straight up. And I think straight up's better for the individual and worse for um your reputation in the world. >> I do think so. I think that's been your your uh challenge throughout your life. So anyway, tonight is called 45 biblically supported reasons organized religion is over and our family wants to offer you a summary of what we've discovered from a contextual analysis of the Bible. Real quick though, did we say how to watch how to tune into that Ratio Christie thing? >> No, I don't know how. >> Sorry about that. You can uh live stream it on either of our YouTube channels, Heart of the Matter or Yeshu. You can watch out on the app. Uh all sorts of things. If you're We recommend you sign up for our app. Um because that's how you'll be in touch with what we're doing. It's not that we spam you or anything, but we just send you notifications of things going on because there's always something going on. Go to yesu.faith if you want to be in communication. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Tonight. >> Wait, I was going to say something else >> and people can to sign in for questions. >> Yeah. If you live stream, you'll see on the screen how to submit your questions, uh, if you want to do that. >> And then one final thing coming up this Sunday is we're starting in on a second series in our 10:00 verse by verse. It's not verse by verse anymore. We call it Sunday schooled. And uh, we >> still doing verse by verse though. >> Yeah, we still do verse by verse on Matthew at 8 a.m. through Matthew. >> And but on the Sunday schooled, we're going more topically. And I'm starting in on a It's like >> I don't know if you hear the noise in the background, but it's >> They've never been louder in the history of being in this building. They've never been louder until we decide to start taping. Hand to God. I swear it's dark forces that that get to work in people. But uh we're going to start in on a new series. It's going to last for quite a while. And it's going to be on like a really solid throughline of the philosophy of the Bible. >> Awesome. >> Yeah, >> that will maybe be somewhat articulated tonight as well. >> It will be well it will be from a different perspective and I'm glad for that. Go ahead. Uh Delane, we know that, you know, our we have put in our family, and I say our family because I've done it, but we have all done it to some extent or another, a lot of time and research to find out what the heck is really something the Bible stands on, teaches clearly without any denominational arm twisting on our part. We don't listen to what anyone says. We listen to what it says. and what Delaney taught us a while ago in the through line of scripture from Genesis to Revelation. How does it lay out what is really happening now in the world? And that's what we want to talk about. >> All right. So, we have a side byside chart we're going to look at and just consider what we're saying um in the in that we can confidently uh defend or articulate why we're teaching this. We know that there are other perspectives, but we have a really strong backing for all these different positions we're going to go through. Um we're going to work through each set of boxes from the left to right together. And like we always say, don't trust us, but test it and see what your findings produce. >> And you know, before we embark on this, just know that if your preference is to be Catholic, Mormon, Baptist, whatever, >> we say fine. >> Yeah. We just think that if you understood what we've discovered and can prove through the Bible, it might help you in that thing you choose to do because it will clarify a lot of things that the churches and pastors cannot make sense of. >> Yeah. The goal of Yeshuins is to flip the order. If it's God, religion, and then people right now, we want to flip the order so it's God, people, and then religion. And people use religion to their at their disposal. Um not getting getting rid of it completely necessarily. >> So uh Delaney said we're going to work from the left to the right in box one. It's the past 2,000 years and then we're going to below in the column to the right the next 2,000 years. That's what we are really trying to summarize here of what we think the Bible has clearly pointed out. >> All right. In the past 2,000 years, you can find how we describe it below that uh line on the left side and it says it's traditional, it's objective. This is the truth. You believe this, you do that. It's denominational and it's religious. M >> yeah that is what has existed and we see it in all the different expressions from the smallest to the biggest right. >> Mhm. >> All right. And so Delaney tell us what is the next 2,000 years? What should it represent? Actually what should it have represented from the back 2,000 years ago but we just weren't ready for that. >> Yeah. I was going to ask if is it just the last 2,000 years or the all time before that as well since the law of Moses? I think since the law of Moses definitely during that time it was certainly number two uh left side it was certainly law it was certainly material it was organized it was denominational certainly that's the biblical model uh even back into when Moses got the law >> right watch the first episode of Epiphany and you'll you'll see that we use the diagram in the background where the red is the law of Moses that's that time the orange is the time of Christ. The yellow is the >> religion since which is what the column on the left is the past 2,000 years like you're talking about. >> Now we hope to have a sharp divide and move into the purple age which is the next 2,000 years and our work is trying to bring us into that age and articulate what that age is. Yeah. And in box two, we describe it generally as being >> fulfilled, subjective, relation, relational, um, via the spirit of the victorious Christ. >> Yeah. We maintain that the victory Christ had over everything that's in that Bible, everything that's written, his victory has brought us into a place where all human beings have the spirit of the victorious Christ in them. Doesn't mean they receive it or pursue it, but we believe that all men like the Quakers believe this have the light of Christ in there. And that accords with the first chapter of John that he is the light that came into all men. And we believe that that is the case today because it is that way. That makes the faith subjective >> because every individual has Christ in them telling them what they should seek and believe and do versus an institution, a brickandmortar, a denominational dogmatically telling them we believe in box two. >> Yeah. There's a weird thing with this perspective because it's both supported as if it should have happened since Christ should have been that way. like Christ made religion subjective but also it's emphasized because it's the reality of today anyway like >> I think it's really rational that we you and yes in our family see religion as already doing that like it's already we all already have our own perspective so how do we work with religion from now on >> better given that condition >> right and Delane's second point there makes so much sense because irrespective of what the Bible message says, what should have been, >> God works through what we're ready for. >> Yeah. >> And we don't think in the past 2,000 years anybody could have really said, "Let's do this new thing now because the world wasn't ready for it." >> So, it's like this thing that Christ came for, the world's finally ready for, >> right? >> In a way. >> Yeah. And that's why a thing that we kind of stand on is that before Christ, everything has been put under his feet. >> But after Christ, God has allowed all things because he works in harmony with what we want and do as people and what we can handle and what we can't. And all of that's at play in his hand. And we don't think that this could have been received maybe 150 years ago. We think, like Delaney said, now it's ready. And we will explain why. All right. >> So, looking to the past 2,000 years, who are the participants of the traditional objective religion? You know it. Roman Catholicism, Orthodoxies, Anglican, Lutheran, Protestant, Restorationist, and all other brickandmortar denominational expressions that are Christ affirming. We say that are Christ affirming for the simple reason that this is a Christ centered approach. He had the victory. So, we include him in all that. Does it mean that the Jews and the Muslims and the others who don't affirm Christ as Lord and Savior uh don't belong? No. They belong to our solution. They belong because the spirit of Christ is in all men. >> So every individual choosing to receive and believe in Christ in them whether they know him by name or on or his anything about him is irrelevant. If they seek to live in them and live directly by that spirit which produces love, they we believe are his. >> Okay? That's why we don't make a deal about Mormons who have the quote unquote wrong Jesus, wrong God, wrong gospel if they have the spirit of Christ in them. They are just as good before God as anybody else. >> Right? And it's why we can we also say it's relevant to other religions now is that there might be individuals in other religions that have this and have and live by the spirit of Christ and don't know it's the spirit of Christ. So they are doing it right without the on or the ontological knowledge. Correct. >> Yeah. >> Exactly. And you know the thing about that point is that's that this solves the question if if pe if religious Christian evangelicals and ardent Mormons are sincere and Catholics. Have you ever wondered why there's so many people in different faiths that are so good and nice and kind and peaceful and and they're so wonderful to be around? How come Christians can't be more like them? They have the spirit of Christ >> and that's why we don't draw denominational lines. M yeah separating the spirit of Christ from Christianity. >> Yeah. >> And allowing it to be wherever it is. >> That's what we are talking about you guys. That is what we are offering for you to consider and to bring into your own walk with God rather than join some religion. You don't join us. We are just proposing what we have discovered as a family. So, I'm going to cover the first box underneath uh the past 2,000 years. And we know that it was law-ab. And it's very masculine. Going back to the Old Testament, very bloody, full of warfare, dos and don'ts. God is mad at you. You're in trouble. Very, very, very material. Everything that the nation of Israel was about was material. But we're talking about the last 2,000 years. >> Last 2,000 years. Yeah, that's what we're talking about. >> Yeah. Oh, okay. And >> what we propose, Delaney is going to cover that what we are saying should come in now that we're ready for it. >> Well, the hope is to see that Christ's answer to the relig masculine religion before him was a more feminine approach, which was uh feminine, not female. um in that it's grace centered and spiritual and relationship oriented rather than um obedienceoriented and uh violent, right? >> So, uh hopefully we're moving into a more loving approach um in the next age. >> And we see that ethic that she calls feminine, not female, as being uh lifegiving. The law kills. Paul said, uh, the Old Testament was about killing. You know, Christ brings lifegiving. That's what women do. So, that's why we call it the feminine. And the traits that Christ brought are very feminine in nature, not female. It's good for a man to be meek and mild and humble and patient and kind and long-suffering and giving uh like a good woman. That's what a Christian man would be. So, we need to get rid of the masculine material. This is the law idea because it's over and Christ fulfilled it. >> All right. >> All right. The next one is the objective doctrinal and practical demands of the last 2,000 years. >> Yeah. And this should be a marketked difference between what we propose because if the faith is now subjective and it's based off the individual's choice on what and how to believe and how to live that it's between them and God. There's no need for any institution to hand down objective doctrinal and practical demands on how to please God. But if we go to that list, Roman Catholics or Protestants, we can see what their objective demands are. >> Yeah. And we say those are over. >> That no longer does a person need to have any material objective demands placed upon them. That includes not even knowing the name of Jibus >> or calling out to him and asking him to receive. Maybe that's important for you internally. He's already there. To call out and recognize him is fine. But man, we have to get away from the sub uh the objective demands. Why? Because the subjective is the reality. >> So the objective idea that we still see probably at its most extreme today is people believing that there's a God and thinking that that God can be understood objectively through the Bible. And so they I'm kind of asking you through these statements but um so they once they come to find that then they go out and argue for it and correct others in that name. >> Our idea is that is not that the existence of an objective god is subjective. It's that we believe that there's a god that does that has a reality and that that's not possible to know collectively, >> right? >> Uh through the Bible, >> right? >> Because we're too that Bible's not for us. We're too far removed from it. Uh that the spirit of Christ is in each individual. So the subjectivity that we're arguing for is in how someone relates to God materially. Is that correct? >> Yeah. And for additional reasons that you uh didn't mention, but I know you know, and that's also because we're all different. We're different people. We've grown up in different places, different parents, different sets of rules and laws. We have different consciences. >> For some things I have no conscience against and some things I do. And and Delaney's different. >> Yeah. >> And then the fact of the matter, the reality is that's how we are anyway. You take any collective group, unless they're a brainwashed cult, >> and you say, "We believe this. >> Everybody in there is going to filter that through their age, gender, experience, life, and they're going to decide what that means to them and if they accept it or not." >> That's so it's already subjective. Yeah. >> And we all die alone and go to God and subjectively are assessed by him, quote unquote. So this subjective demand that this must be is not a reality. It's it hasn't been a reality for thousands of years. >> Yeah. It's and that that fact that's it's that same duality where like it was a reality in Christ time but society wasn't able to like universally see that reality until now. and whatever's happened culturally, we're like it's broken open the ability for us to see the system doesn't work anymore for a lot of things, but most especially for faith. >> Yeah. >> And like so if you look culturally back to the 50s, people can say church works. Our family gets up and goes and we're all really and look at society, it's working. Yeah. >> It's not working anymore. >> Yeah. and the the desperate attempts for religion to make it work again, make America great again, whatever it is. It's like a reversion back to something that won't exist anymore. It's not possible. >> Yeah. And I love the fact that you brought that up, Delaney, because um you know, if you look today at a resurgence of masculine, law-abiding, objectively demanded religion, you find it in the extreme groups. uh fundamentalist uh I mean it's like bombs are going off now. Fundamentalist Islam, fundamentalist Mormons, fundamentalist uh Calvinists. >> Yes. >> All three of those groups are hearkening back to the old way because they think that's how we're going to govern the world. And >> literally arguing for women to have their vote repealed. >> Women to shut up in church. Women to be put to death for an abortion. It's all putting women. Women aren't the problem here, you know? I mean, they contribute to the problem, but men are the original source of the problem, and they're the ones who need to lead their families in love like Christ loved the church and get away from all this masculine religion. But our society is going back to this model. And we are telling you it's not going to work. It's never worked. And that is a reversion back to pure m pat matriarchy. Yeah, it it might have worked teologically, but it didn't work for what Christ came to do originally. >> And that's such an important point because in our world, we can do things that work, >> but it doesn't make them right. >> Yeah, that's the thing I think. Uh yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't know. >> I mean, I hate to, this isn't political, but I had a conversation with somebody who said, "What exactly is the problem?" Uh, and I'm not saying I know the problem, but what exactly is the perceived problem with Donald Trump? >> And they said, "Isn't it good that we do want people who come into the country illegally and don't go through all the hoops for them to do that?" >> And my response is, "That is a good thing. We should do that, you know, because that's how we survive and keep order in our country." >> But it's the method by which we're doing it that calls in other people into question. >> So, it's not the thing in of itself that's wrong. It's the method of doing it. And that's our problem with most religion today. It's their method. >> Yeah. And how I just ask anyone that's >> arguing for material religion to have a resurgence. I really want to know how they're going to make that happen because the how is going to be by like tying someone up and forcing them to be a part of it. That's the only way it's going to happen. >> So that comes through shame and guilt and law. So clearly it doesn't work. >> It does not work. >> That's why that's why we're saying it doesn't work anymore. I think there was a time where >> uh society understood women in a certain way so it did work but today we don't so it doesn't work anymore. Like that's we have to change. >> Yeah. And this is fundamental to our family's view of God in that out of love he changes with his human creations. >> So that Yeah. We could talk about this for so long. We should keep going through the list. But that's what's so blasphemous to people, I think, is this suggestion that God changes, right? >> But it's not that God changes. It's that Christ finished the work and God is working >> at this miraculous individual scale with each person for a large unchanging goal. Yeah. like that. We have no concept to Yeah. Like we can't say what that is. >> Yeah. I mean, impossible. And yet we try. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> It's not possible to say what the collective goal of God is. >> My goodness. These are improvements. Number six, and by the way, we might only get through 10 of these [laughter] and then we can uh have a show for the next three weeks. >> Yeah, I guess so. But >> number six is religious authority of men demanding doctrines and dogmas were in place. We've kind of covered that. But the important thing is in that sense the authority >> of men. >> And I personally, I don't know if Delany has a problem with it, but I personally don't see anybody who has a real, believable, reasonable, biblical, logical link to human beings having any authority. >> Yeah. >> Over others. There's that is actually probably the worst part of it is that as a person claiming that they have authority and you've been in touch with that because of your resistance to someone telling you that they're between you and God. Um I there's another way to see it too that's like the like you're saying the doctrines and dogmas are a vehicle for a a person or an entity like a denomination to have power over people like as a collective and then men put themselves in association with that collective to feel powerful and are proud and yeah it's just >> and we see historical evidence for what she just said uh by looking at the establishment of the creeds where there was an idea that there's a god and there was his son and men decided listen we need to codify codify this so that we aren't fighting each other and we can use our imperialistic natures to dominate the world through Christianity that's that's the banner that uh Constantine saw on the heavens through Christ you will have victory on this earth and so they started >> that's what it said, >> "Yeah, he had a vision of a banner in heaven and he said, "You will win through this." >> And so, here we start to establish codes for how to believe. And the Trinity was one of them, as well as eternal punishment and all these other things that are not true in the faith today. >> Yeah. I've never really sat and thought about what what was the motivation for a group of men to get together and decide on codes for faith. >> Yeah. >> Like what what was going on in the world? Why did they feel the need? What is there a way that there could have been like a good motivation out of it? >> Well, God could have used it for good to get us through to the point where he keeps unfolding things. Sure. men, you know, he's like, "Okay, if you're going to do that, let's do this." Now, I don't know. But bottom line is men when they see chaos or threats to what they believe >> is headed their way, they fortify themselves through. And so Aryan came along and he said, "Yeah, Jesus wasn't God." >> And they said, "No, no, no. Jesus was God. We need Jesus to lead us. Let's codify who he was." and they through the Holy Spirit and the Father all in that thing called the Trinity. >> That's what's going on will always go on is that um >> is that it's a need for control. It's a need for control. >> Yeah. And so, and that need for control perhaps comes from a good place in the hearts of these men where they want God to be in the world and everybody to know him and but it's antithetical because a it has to come by force. But b they what you your point which it took me so long to understand is that why isn't God more powerful? like why do you have to establish that control on earth? Why can't God do that in individual's hearts? >> And >> even if Aryan leads people astray or whatever, why can't God come in and fix that? >> Because men think they need to intercede for him >> instead of believing what Christ said and that the spirit goes where it wants and so are those who follow it. >> You know, why don't pastors who teach God will do everything for you believe that? >> Instead, they do everything to show they need to do things. We are fully on the side of trusting God with everything and not worrying about even dogma, doctrines, practices. We say Christ has done it. We trust him. Whatever happens happens. >> Wow. >> All right. >> Warped the more we talk about it. >> Oh, it just keeps getting >> warped. [laughter] >> And then the the I'll read this one. the past 2,000 years has been primarily collective and primarily participative. >> Uh meaning that if you're a Catholic that you gather with other Catholics and you do what other Catholics have decided it's important to do. And that's why when we start when we side by side put religions on earth and compare them, we say Mormonism is the best because in terms of man-made religion doing what is going to collectively use human power to do things, Mormonism beats uh beats everybody. Yeah, >> it does. >> Yeah. But that doesn't make it true. >> Again, Catholics seem to have a pretty strong >> They're pretty good on it, too. >> Yeah. They do it without all that. They do it with guilt and shame, but they do it pretty well. >> Yeah. It's very prevalent. Yeah. Clearly. >> Yeah. Um so, and so we just say there's no religious authority, but the reigning spirit of Christ promoting faith and agape love. And it's primarily the faith is primarily independent. >> It's between the individual and God, nobody else. And it's informationbased, which we're going to get to in the next one, but that's important for us to help you know. It's not religiously practiced and based. It's educationally presented. >> Can I ask a clarification? Uh so when we talk about religious then religious means that God is being represented in a thing like um because we think that if some like the institution can exist and do things for people in all the ways that they already do but the fact that they claim God is the problem and that's what's religious. Is that right? >> Um to me the religious tie into God that churches make is what makes all the other things they do religious. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All the other things they do could not be religious if they didn't >> if they didn't have God with God. Right. Right. >> We are trying to say religion is in opposition to God. that yes, God will allow you to participate with religions because we're human and we like to gather and collect with like-minded people, but the reality is that collective uh association is not getting you into a relationship or the kingdom. And that is how religion using his name messes with people. >> You know, it really is more about the individual whether they're in a religion or not. and and and that's why it's hard for me to even call what we're doing religious >> because I just don't see any of the uh associations present. >> Right. So, and that's why there's a Mormon there's two Mormons in the same ward going to the same church and one's religious and one isn't. Yeah. >> Because one puts that church between >> them and God and one just uses that church. That's right. >> And relates to God on their own. >> That's right. That's the whole thing. >> Yeah. >> That's what religion religion is putting. >> It's idolatry. It's putting that material in association with God that isn't. Is that right? >> Yeah. Good point. Yeah. >> And that's why we say there are good Mormon people who are just as close to God as a good Catholic or anybody else. >> So then the next point where the past 2,000 years have been religious. What should the next 2,000 years be? I suggest, Delaney suggests, our family suggests that the best way to approach all of these things is through uh not religious education, but um biblical education of all God has done and then what that means to us today. Educate yourself on what the text actually says. You choose how you want to see it and believe it and go forward on your own. >> Right? So there's a way that a a Mormon going to their church right now actually sees it as education. Yeah. And that's correct. >> Yeah. >> Like the Mormon church could just be doing education. If you're seeing it as religious education or whatever, like telling you how God's doing X, Y, and Z, then it's a problem. But >> so that's that's the defination here is gaining information and then taking the responsibility yourself to figure out what to do with it >> rather than someone else >> giving you information and telling you God wants you to do this. >> Exactly. And that's why we say education is the future for the faith. >> It is not religious practice because >> of everything you just said >> and education isn't a formal thing. It's not M divs and all that. It's it's learning. It's like going out in the world when you go to a fast food restaurant and observing the person in front of you. That's a form of education rather than it's actively living rather than passively living. Right. >> Your if we were going to say religious training is your life. >> Yes. >> Yes. That that's all your religious training is. It's not. Well, I mean, if we're going to use that term, your >> I see. Yeah. >> In in placement of doing what the church says, your religion is the life you live. >> Yes. >> Yeah. And not what someone else tells you to do. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And in terms of that educational thing, you know, we have spent uh quite a few years, decades creating educational content for people who want to without religious affiliation and affirmation and denomination hear what we see the truth as in the throughine of the Bible is in terms of all God has done >> so that you can then decide how you want to live today. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. and go to and be a part of it. Yes, you stop faith. >> Yeah, >> if you want. >> If you want, >> be a part. >> And that's the other thing. >> Challenge it. Challenge it. That's the whole point. >> Yeah. Challenge your faith. Go through our verse by verse in Hebrews. Go listen to I don't get the Bible through Hebrews and and lay what we discover and talk about there against what you've been taught by your church >> or any book that we've got there. I just want to mention we had a comment on our recent I don't get the Bible Hebrews. >> Oh. >> Talking about how Hebrews dismantles Mormon claims to authority. And someone commented maybe our interpretation is wrong. The Mormons go directly to God for their interpretation. And it was just the most interesting comment because I'm like I think that's what we're trying to argue that you do. But so >> no, they go directly to their brethren for the interpretation >> or Joseph or whole bunch of other >> other things. The manual what the doctrine is that what a big joke that comment was. >> Yeah, it was kind of surreal to read that. >> And you know, just while we're just sitting here on this, I just want to say I firmly believe that everyone gets what they want. You know, a Mormon who wrote that comment is getting what he or she wants. That's what they see in Mormonism. That's what they believe. They can have it. >> But the scripture does say that God is looking for those who diligently seek him in spirit and truth. And he doesn't make his truths readily apparent. >> They have to be sought for. So if you want to be a Catholic who never opens the Bible or a Mormon who only listens to their prophets or any of that, you can. God has given you life. He sent his son to save you. Fine. But we're here to educate you on what the thing really says. >> All right. Next one about public worship. How is it conducted now then and now? Uh well, public worship and this is a big divider among all religious folks is is typically broken up in terms of um your prayers, >> public prayers that you give with the group, the music that you sing to and um the service that you give in terms of voluntary uh service or money. Those are the ways that the religions codified have taken us worship in the faith and they have said this is how you can worship people who come to us. >> We pray together, we sing together, we serve and give and that's our service to God through the institution. But I would suggest that God has given his spirit of his son in you to individually choose when and how to worship. Meaning how you pray, meaning if you sing and the music you listen to to worship God through it. I worship God through punk. I I can barely worship God through most modern Christian music. And this is something that has broken me forward to try to see it in a different way because the school of ministry I went to, all the guys are just rocking out to this really horrible music. >> And I just sat there thinking I can't relate to God through this. >> So we I realized that it's through our preferential music, you know, it might for someone might be shopan or or it might be rap. It touches them emotionally and it leads their thoughts to God that it should be that liberal instead of worship being when you talk about baby Jesus in the manger, you know. >> Yeah. Worship that it it seems as though the past 2,000 years that people think worship is a collective act. Yeah. >> I think maybe that's the problem. Yeah. >> Is it? What is the what is the um biblical justification for collective worship? Well, the collective worship is what the Jews did. They would have convocations. They'd have agre they'd have holidays and they would all get together very very much the model for organized religion today. And again, the Mormons do it well, >> you know, and the orthodoxies do it well. They have a lot of feasts, a lot of different things. But when the scripture in other places lays it out that all the material is done and Christ finished that approach to him and now it comes from the heart of the individual. We maintain that an individual who's never stepped in church to sing that they can worship him in spirit and truth according to how they want to give, how they want to serve, how they want to pray, and whatever music inspires them to think of God first and foremost. This breaks it outside of what all the religious stuff has been. >> I have friends who have said to me that Christianity is inherently a social uh faith because it requires two people like it there's always another person that needs love like it requires other people to >> cannot disagree with that in terms of trying to codify the faith on earth. >> Yeah. But the application of that to them is you go to church and you worship together. Like it's just the opposite where it's like to us the collective part of it is or the social part of it is that you go out into the world and act that faith out. It's not an insular worship where the collectivity is in the worship. It's the collectivity in the >> right >> uh manifestation of their faith. Yeah. Would you say? >> Yeah, I would say that. And and the reason I say that in addition to what you've said, Delaney, is that um when you get in a collective, then the heartfelt things that a person wants to do have to be truncated to what have to be sublimated to what the group does. >> Okay? And so therefore, there's a phoniness and a disingenuousness in the collective because everyone's doing it. How many of them really fa believe that or feel that? >> Peer pressure to to do >> peer pressure giving your worship is it is it voluntary or do you give because the plate is passed in front of you. We maintain that because Christ and the the veil was written too >> and God said through that act there is no separation between me and you anymore >> that every individual should be free to worship as they're inclined as they're led in whatever way they want. Now if it is in a collective setting go ahead. >> Yeah. But I would be very careful about collectivity when it comes to you thinking you're justifying yourself before God. >> And to someone who want like I think mostly they want community. People want the feeling of being around others. It it gets lonely like it's understandable. What do you say to that? I say fine, you know, but there are other things where I think you could be more effectively used in the with the spirit of Christ in you than a community of like-minded believers. Because in that, all you're doing is patting each other on the back of the great things that you do. Imagine you establishing your community as a yeshuan in a bowling league of people who smoke, drink, and swear. and you go in there and you shine a light of him with non-judgment, non-shame, non-g guilt, not sing my music. This is what we're trying to say is the solution to the problem of religion today. >> And we're at the tail end of it because like you pointed out in a uh previous point, the the proprietary doctrine owned by the church now is the place where people go to get filled up. Yeah. in order to go out and live their lives and show love. Everyone wants needs this time to go get filled up. So they go to church >> when they could get filled up by just reading the word themselves and then going out and actually learning rather than >> other people filling you up. >> Yeah. and taking your pocketbook with an extra 20 in it and not thinking that you got to give it to the church so the pastor can fulfill his dream. Yes. But you have a neighbor who is hurting and you have the extra. You give it to your neighbor directly. >> Yeah. >> This is what we're trying to say is the future of the faith in this world because the collective, what have they done with all this collective stuff? They've abused it. >> Yeah. >> And they've hurt other people. They've molested them. They've ostracized them. They haven't fed the poor. They've built up uh empires around themselves. It's all there if you look at it. This this discussion is really good. >> Yeah, >> this is really How far are we in in time? >> Really helpful. Um you don't know. >> I do. We have probably like five minutes to >> All right, we'll go a couple more and then we will continue on this with part two next week. But uh we just finished off on talking about private worship in spirit and truth. You know, that's what God wants. He wants us to worship him in spirit and truth. So when I >> personally >> personally individually when I read that I said I am not worshiping him in truth when I sing a song I hate >> no or like looking at someone else and how their hands are raised and feeling like I should be doing that. Like >> none of that is about truth about other people. It's giving because everyone in the row is looking at you, you know, and so you do the old fake and drop, you know, it's this is how religion works against what God seeks. And that's the authentic heart. >> So the next one is um what is the next one? >> Through priesthoods, altars, authorities, rights, rituals, demands of allegiance. >> Yeah, this is like the last 2,000 years have been in religion. And what should it be in the next age? Uh you know you guys if you read the through line of scripture uh you cannot get around you can't get around the fact that God emphatically wanted the nation of Israel wanted Adam and Eve and wanted everybody thereafter to worship him and him alone and serve no other no other. Okay. And in the past 2,000 years, men doing what they should not have probably done have I they have turned intermediaries into idols [snorts] because it's through the intermediaries that human beings think of themselves as relating directly to God and they're not. So a priesthood, did you know in the apostolic record the priesthood is only in reference to what was existed in the Old Testament. The word priests is only in reference to that. It's never about people who follow Christ. Never. Because we are a he is our high priest. So you don't have a priesthood. I hear Mormons when I was LDS talk about so grateful for the priesthood. My God, I want to swear right now. so grateful for the priesthood. >> It's unreal the idol that that freaking thing is. As well as I'm so grateful that our bishop has the authority. He has no authority. God's the authority. Or altars in the Catholic Church and and and and the Bible. >> I mean, evangelicals worship the Bible. We have these kids come in, they open their Bible, and they're just like, they can't even look and think and talk through the spirit within them. They're looking through the Bible to justify it. That thing is an idol >> and it is not the word of God. Do I mean it contains the word of God? I do. Is it is not the word of God. Is not. Watch our teaching on Matthew. Oh, last week. >> Yeah. >> On the Yeshua. And then I'm sorry it's it's my pet peeve, but anytime you have a ritual, >> anytime you say people say, "Are you a Christian?" Well, I was baptized. >> Oh god, it's just like, wow, do you really think that God cares? And you know, demands of allegiance. >> Yeah. I'm a Catholic. I'm a Mormon. I'm a Baptist. You are none of those things. You are either his or you're not. So that's idolatry. >> Yep. >> Yeah. Um, and what should it be if all those things are removed? >> Direct by the spirit responsibility to God alone. >> That's how I say I'm a Christian anarchist, >> not secular anarchy. God alone directly. And that is in and through his son who is God. So you don't even have to make that qualifier. God alone. >> No other inter intermediary. Whatever you think about most, give your most time and attention to, uh, honor, serve, work for, try to impress, that's your God. >> And if it's any of those things that we just mentioned, you're an idoltor. >> I'm not saying he's going to punish you because Christ gets the human need to have material things that we love. But I I can't emphasize more the import of no gods before him. >> Do we have time to move or or no? >> Uh, let's do this last one. static and unmovable. >> That is the past 2,000 years. >> Even though it did change over those years, the perception of what they were doing was that they were finding this fixed. >> Yeah. >> They don't see that it changed. Except the Catholics think they didn't change. Except they didn't exist >> until you come from change in the first place. >> Yeah. And the Protestants, you know, they have no right for to have rebelled against the Catholic unchangeable church, but they did. And Martin Luther authority broke from them. Orthodoxy in 1054 broke from the Catholic Church without authority. So they stop the unity of the faith that Christ preached just by breaking off and starting a new approach that they think is better. So they don't have authority either. And all the ones that hearken back to the early church petristic fathers they lack authority. Mormonism is fictional. I was visited by a ghost. Uh you know fully lacks authority. There is no authority. Any man who stands above you. Let me tell you something. They're a sinner. >> They are fully a sinner in every way uh shape or form that the flesh if eat of it doesn't do. It's in their nature. We look to God alone through the spirit of Christ that's victorious in us. And we always see ourselves as defective. Anybody in a pew looking up at this should have that. And anybody in any other church should say, "I listen to him or her as a teacher. I'll consider what they have to say." But they are not any sort of intermediary. None. >> And as more and more people embrace what we're talking about, we will start to see this world and the faith change. Um, yeah. >> Okay. >> I think I think we should wrap it on that. That was a good end note. >> We're wrapping on that one and we will uh catch up with you next week. >> Continuing this this chart >> this chart. >> This is really good. I really liked this. >> Me, too. Thank you. >> All right. We'll see you next time. >> [music] >> Please [music] hang it down. Heat. Heat. [music]